I read the same thing in the manual yesterday because my forgies are currently dismounted awaiting shipping for PC and I was debating picking up some 190s.

On my 10, I had an imbecile put 190/50 on my rear and my TC didn't like it. I believe your dealer and without the Calibration software (or factory change) then it may be best avoided.

 

Would be good to get a definitive answer.

 

According to BMW's bulletin - it is for sure.

I know some guys have said they have really pushed their bikes and didn't notice the traction control kicking in - a few have changed tire size - maybe the reason they didn't feel it - is because it wasn't working?

 

On my S1000RR 2010 there is absolutely no problem when I put a 200 rear. I have used Michelin Power One and Dunlop KR that are 200 tires with no problems at all.

 

Trust me I believe you -and know a few guys as well that have switched and have not noticed any thing wrong.

Now could it for some reason be only related to HP4's and 2015 RR's with the forged wheel option?

 

I've had 3 different brands of 190's on my 2011, all of which measured different circumferences and height and I've had 2 different types of 200 series slicks on my bike at the track; not one single issue.

 

I'm thinking this is coming from a pssible liability issue - if BMW states it should not be done it gets them off the hook.

Heck how sensitive is the system - if you keep the tire on until it is almost bald - it certainly is not the same size it was when new.

 

I know that you do not have a lot of choices for a street oriented tire but I think that in the future the most common tire size for 1000cc Superbike and above it will be the 200. For the track almost every brand has a track oriented 200 tire like Pirelli, Dunlop, Michelin etc.

 

I'm going to ride the bike mostly at track days. I was just thinking I would run something like Q3's a lot less money. In the scheme of things it really is no big deal.

 

while i may agree that tire size does matter what it says on the tire wall doesnt matter. a 190 tire can be labeled 200 and vice versa.

fact the 200/55 pirelli supercorse tire is 193 mm wide
fact the 190/55 dunlop q3 is 193.5 mm wide

fact either tire can be labled 190 or 200 you have a 10mm play in there.

ducati says the same thing yet the rain mode tire in the manual is a diablo corse not a super corse

so let me ask you this every time i get caught in the rain am i suppose to change the tires?

its all a legal thing.
here is what ducati says notice the tire changes

1 RACE Track use, for very expert riders, optimized for Pirelli tires
with SC2 compound.
System permits sliding sideways.
NO
2 RACE Track use, for very expert riders, optimized for OEM tires
(Original Equipment Manufacturer)
Permits sliding sideways.
It is the default level
for the “RACE” Riding
Mode
3 RACE Track use for expert riders.
Permits sliding sideways.
NO
4 RACE Track use (and road use for expert riders). NO
5 SPORT Sport style on the road or on the track, consistent with
ENGINE 195cv LOW setting (maximum power 195HP,
with Smooth delivery).
It is the default level
for the “SPORT”
Riding Mode
6 SPORT “Very safe“ style on dry surface, on the road or on the
track, consistent with ENGINE 195cv LOW setting
(maximum power 195HP, with Smooth delivery).
NO
7 WET
(RAIN)
Track use, with rain tires, it was specifically optimized for
Pirelli Diablo Rain tires (rear tire 190/55 ZR17)
NO
8 WET
(HEAVY RAIN)
Wet road and slippery asphalt with OEM tires; it must be
associated with ENGINE 120 setting
It is the default level
for the “WET” Riding
Mode

 

while i may agree that tire size does matter what it says on the tire wall doesnt matter. a 190 tire can be labeled 200 and vice versa.

fact the 200/55 pirelli supercorse tire is 193 mm wide
fact the 190/55 dunlop q3 is 193.5 mm wide

fact either tire can be labled 190 or 200 you have a 10mm play in there.

And this is likely what it boils down to. You just have to measure and if it's too far out of spec, then it will need adjustment.

The fact that the calibration kit offers that adjustability is proof enough for me that it makes enough of a difference in some capacity.

 

So can anyone offer some understanding of the impact on TC of a 190 vs 200? (assuming its a 200/55)

Does that mean it kicks in earlier, later, not at all? Rationale?

 

Extracts from a BMW inter-dealer memo:

'For the s1000rr,there are various alternatives available in terms of wheels(cast or forged),as well as rear tyres(190/200).
For the control systems(ABS,DTC etc)to operate satisfactorily,it is essential that the correct tyre size has been encoded on the vehicle

This is because incorrect encoding results in detrimental effects in the operation of the traction control system:

Incorrect encoding in the case of the 190 tyre leads to detrimental effects in comfort in terms of the traction control system(pumping)
Incorrect encoding in the case of the 200 tyre leads to losses in forward momentum for the traction control system'

'At present,it is only possible to encode the tyre size ex works Berlin
It is planned to make it possible for the tyre size to be encoded at dealerships,probably from June 2015'

 

Also whats the impact on TC of a 200/60 vs 55 slick.

 

190 vs 200 my 2 Cents

My 2015 has forged HP wheels and came with Pirelli Diablo Supercorsas,

I just did 4 days at Almeria, first day on the Pirellis then changed to Metzeler Comp K slicks, the rear is a 190, I was concerned about this, but I had NO Problems with TC and the bike behaved perfectly.

I measured the tyres, there was only 5mm difference across the tyre and about 10mm difference total rolling circumference.

The ECU has a 10% 'wriggle factor' built in so you should be fine with a 190 or a 200 tyre.

Mark.

 

My 2015 has forged HP wheels and came with Pirelli Diablo Supercorsas,



I just did 4 days at Almeria, first day on the Pirellis then changed to Metzeler Comp K slicks, the rear is a 190, I was concerned about this, but I had NO Problems with TC and the bike behaved perfectly.



I measured the tyres, there was only 5mm difference across the tyre and about 10mm difference total rolling circumference.



The ECU has a 10% 'wriggle factor' built in so you should be fine with a 190 or a 200 tyre.



Mark.

I do tend to agree, the 200/60 slick is also out of spec but everything appears to work fine. The 190/55 will only be out of spec in one dimension.

 

there must be some "wriggle room" , for example:

If you ride on the street at 42psi and go do a trackday at half that psi ??

you have to get a recalibration ?? then get it recallibrated back again ??

if so, thats ridiculous

 

I will be following this post closely! I have the 2015 with forged wheels and the 200/55 Pirellis. With about 770 miles on it, I am ALREADY seeing the wear bars in the rear Pirellis. And about 640 of the initial miles were obviously below 9000 rpm.
I realize my riding style is the slow-in-fast-out-square-the-turn variety so I do tend to cook the rears way before the fronts, but this is ridiculous. So I went online to look for my trusty Dunlop Q3... only to notice they do NOT make 'em in 200/55.
A buddy of mine with a 2014 S1000RR has had TC nightmares changing the rear, in his case he went UP to the 200/60 Dunlops. And got all kinds of fails. Will check with what his story has been and post back.

 

Pirelli Diablo Supercorsa SP after 760 miles


pic host

Mostly canyon riding, 2nd/3rd gear stuff. Note the difference in the tread height towards the crown (lots) vs. near the side (worn down), causing the tread indicator to show.

My Q3s would give me about 2000 miles and maybe a track day, these tires seem to wear down a lot faster. And they cost more money.

 

The TC has a +-10% factor built into it. I believe Drago on the forum touched on this and ill look for the thread. Will a larger or smaller tire put you +-10%? I have no idea.
Another thing to consider is that you actually have to be fast enough on the track for this to effect you. Are you accelerating hard enough out of a turn to get the TC light to come on in race/slick mode?
I'd also check your wheel speed sensors and alignments if you are getting a ton of failures before pointing a finger at tire sizes.
I run 190/60 dunlop 211s on the track with no issues. I know several other people running 200/55 and 200/60 with no issues.

 

There was a memo out from BMW saying you could use certain190 55 tires when I picked up my 13. I've been using the pilot road 3's since new and never had any issues. I also did all the measurements like Mark. Width is close on the tires but the stock Pirellis are noticeably taller, still no issues.

I wish the Tire manufactures would get on board with the bigger 200/55 rubber in something durable.

 

This is interesting, wonder what the real story on this is. I plan on running a set of Metzler M7's (200/55 rear) so it won't be an issue for me. The 200 vs 190 seems to be only about a $12 change in price. I'm running the M3's now, but if I can get a 20% (claimed) increase in tire life vs the M5's (M3's getting about the same life as the M5's I tried) then it'll be worth it to me.

 

This is why I went to the Prelli Diablo Rosso Corsa tyre. It has the same compound on the shoulders as the SP/SC tyres, but a harder middle compound. I was getting 800 miles out of the original Metzeler and the Pirelli SP... I got up to 3,000 miles out of a rear Diablo Rosso Corsa and it was still a freaking great tyre for the occasional track day, even though I run slicks these day.

I put over 50,000 miles on my bike and commuted every day, so the expense of changing tyres every 800 miles would have meant me using around 18 sets of tyres a year at around $8,000.!!!!

 

I used a 200 55 dunlop slick for 2 track days at a level 3 pace with absolutely no issues. This was on a 2013 s1000rr in the texas summer heat.

 

All good to swap tyre sizes , dealer told me to bring bike in to have electronics recalibrated , a very quick job , he didn't tell me the cost tho .

 

That's for the 2015 skrr

 

I've switched to the 190/55, want to have better tip-in, change of direction.

 

For the 200/55

Metzler M7? or Rosso Corsa? or Battlax S20s?

I've been using Rosso Corsa on my Panigale and only gotten 2300-2600 miles out of them. Haven't use the other 2 before.

Which one would you choose with street/canyon grip having a slight priority over longevity?

Also which one of these warm up the fastest?

 

Can't say, I've been a Metzler man since about '87. On my '01 Gixxer 1000 I'm getting 3,800 - 4,600 miles on the rear of an M3 or M5, and the M7 is touted as getting 20% more life than a M5, so that's enough for me to want to try them. It's a dual-compound tire with stickier edges, but a slightly harder center, which will be perfect for my long trips and canyon riding.

 

I've got a 2015 without forged wheels and it came with Metzler 190/55's. Looks like about $200 for a replacement so I'm thinking of going back to my Q3 which are about $50 cheaper. The K3's feel okay but I haven't pushed them too much.. According to my bank sensor only pushed em to 53 degrees (that's a fun gadget to have). Anyway, there must be a way to calibrate becuase mine came with the 190's.

 

I have had two 2010 s1000rr's and one 2012 s1000rr, and have used Dunlop 200/55/17 rear slicks and Pirelli Supercorsa 200/60/17 for hundreds of laps over the last four years at Daytona, Jennings, Barber without any issues.

TC and ABS worked great.

 

M7 or Conti sport attack 2 is my preference

 

You don't need to re calibrate, I have the forged wheels and it came with 200 Super Corsa tyres.

I rode at Almeria in March, first day on Super Corsas then fitted Metzeler slicks, rear is a 190 section, there was NO problem with the TC and no need to calibrate.

Before I left for Spain, I checked with my dealer, he confirmed that they cannot re calibrate and there is no need to.

 

OR... you can just run 200-width rear tires and not have to run the risk of TC throwing faults.
But the report from the front (Almeria at that... nice!) is reassuring. Someone who has measured them says that the width differential between the Dunlop Q3 190 and the Pirelli Supercorsa SP 200 is negligible. Apparently the standards for what you can label width are not super exact.

Regarding BMW memos. Last week my dealer showed me a memo saying that installing the HP cover kit to remove the front and rear turn signals and licence plate, as well as the mirrors... voids the warranty as the bike is then considered a "race bike". I pointed out to my dealer that there is a whole chapter in the manual about removing those lights, and even suggesting you use the race cover kit, and nowhere does it say the warranty will be voided. So beware the memos.

Thanks for the report. Makes me feel better about putting on Q3s in the future although darn it, those Pirellis sure do grip great!