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Discussion Starter #1
I often hear people mentioning that certain techniques make a motorcycle "easier to turn". However I have heard a reputable source say in the same talk that the brakes make the bike easier to go in the turn, and then that the throttle makes the bike "easier to turn" coming off the corner. And what does "easier to turn" actually mean? The bars become lighter? The bike is more responsive with the same pressure? Would the brakes make the bars lighter or heavier? Thoughts?
 

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Turn the steering damper a few clicks in softer direction. That makes it alot easier to turn. :whistle:

Oh, on track at speed. I think a decreasing radius turn vs a smooth curve type corner will have those different approaches. Approach with the brakes, steer off with the throttle.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Decreased rake, trail, wheelbase, and forward weight bias is probably what was being referred to coming into the turn and oversteer with rear weight bias coming out of the turn.
Agreed.

With the geometry being changed by loading the front, what would that effectively do to the ease of turning with regard to required handlebar pressure?
 

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Decreased rake, trail, wheelbase, and forward weight bias is probably what was being referred to coming into the turn and oversteer with rear weight bias coming out of the turn.
Same rider, same bike, same geometry, rake, trail, wheelbase and forward weight bias:
Rider says:"Bike does not turn at all!!!"
Then rider changes driving line.
Rider says:"Bike turns like a dream!!!"
 

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I often hear people mentioning that certain techniques make a motorcycle "easier to turn". However I have heard a reputable source say in the same talk that the brakes make the bike easier to go in the turn, and then that the throttle makes the bike "easier to turn" coming off the corner. And what does "easier to turn" actually mean? The bars become lighter? The bike is more responsive with the same pressure? Would the brakes make the bars lighter or heavier? Thoughts?
You said it already:

the brakes make the bike easier to go in the turn, and then that the throttle makes the bike "easier to turn" coming off the corner
 

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Same rider, same bike, same geometry, rake, trail, wheelbase and forward weight bias:
Rider says:"Bike does not turn at all!!!"
Then rider changes driving line.
Rider says:"Bike turns like a dream!!!"
Riding line, not driving line
 

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Aside from suspension, engine configuration, and geometry setup.
Bike's width (K67 Vs K46), GSXR Vs Zx10 Vs R1. And seating ergonomics affect how the bike leans based on inputs, at least for me.

Driving line, throttle, and brakes application will have the biggest effect on turning.
Under heavy braking the bike won't turn well. But under light braking it turns much faster.
Steering input pressure and hanging body parts off the bike (upper body, inside leg dangle).

While leaning some throttle input helps the bike lean into the line better. Many people confuse opening the throttle will make the bike go wide, but they don't realize the timing and lean transition affect widening or tightening the line. The opposite can be argued for bike pickup on exit. This is hard to explain, but it took me a while to realize.

Think of above as multiple knobs, a rider need to dial them in to turn the bike in a certain direction and speed. A good measure of a rider's skill is how fast they can go in a flat camber 90d corner from full upright to full lean. Can be measured easily in a video taken of riders, anything over .5sec is slow.
 

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A good measure of a rider's skill is how fast they can go in a flat camber 90d corner from full upright to full lean. Can be measured easily in a video taken of riders, anything over .5sec is slow.
If you are trail braking, you really do not want to flip the bike from full upright to full lean in .5sec or less.
 

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Bike geometry is essential key for easy turning. At certain time, when you get the body position right, this will become a key points actually
 

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If you are trail braking, you really do not want to flip the bike from full upright to full lean in .5sec or less.
Trail braking is not an off/on switch, it's gradual and progressive. Braking starts 100% and goes down until speed and direction are achieved.
Once trail braking hits around 50% the bike can be turned, braking pressure is inversely proportional to lean angle (reduce braking pressure, add lean angle).
If done properly the transition speed from full upright to full lean can be done in under .5sec with trail braking. And I don't see how can anyway ride fast and safely without trailbraking.
 

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Trail braking is not an off/on switch, it's gradual and progressive. Braking starts 100% and goes down until speed and direction are achieved.
Correct.
Once trail braking hits around 50% the bike can be turned, braking pressure is inversely proportional to lean angle (reduce braking pressure, add lean angle).
Incorrect.
If done properly the transition speed from full upright to full lean can be done in under .5sec with trail braking. And I don't see how can anyway ride fast and safely without trailbraking.
Incorrect.

If you are trail braking, you really do not want to flip the bike from full upright to full lean in .5sec or less.
 

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Incorrect.

Incorrect.

If you are trail braking, you really do not want to flip the bike from full upright to full lean in .5sec or less.
Can you elaborate more on what's incorrect? Full upright still includes 10-15% of lean and at least 80-100% braking.
 

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Can you elaborate more on what's incorrect? Full upright still includes 10-15% of lean and at least 80-100% braking.
You can not brake 80-100%, if you lean 10-15%. You would need 95-110% of traction.
 

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Lower the unsprung weigh of the front wheel, calipers, or rotors can make the steering quicker. Also the profile of the front tire can make the steering easier.
 
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