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Here we go! C.A.R.B. is kicking off a new regulatory effort aimed at on-highway motorcycle emissions. Their first public workshop will be held on:

April 11, 2018
9530 Telstar Ave.
El Monte, CA 91731

or via:

GoToMeeting
https://attendee.gotowebinar.com/register/8622501416095711746
Webinar ID: 767-608-603
United States: +1 (562) 247-8422
Audio PIN: Shown after joining the webinar
 

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#justanotherreasonwhyCaliforniasucksobad

...and remember, you guys voted them all into office.....
 

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Cali may continue to do their own thing, but Trump states the process of rolling back EPA vehicle emissions regulations are beginning, going to be interesting to watch.
 

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Cali may continue to do their own thing, but Trump states the process of rolling back EPA vehicle emissions regulations are beginning, going to be interesting to watch.
EPA director has supposedly rolled back the Obama S__t. 54mpg requirement. C.A.R.B. is a dinosaur. They declared their job done back in '95 or '96. Sadly they are still here because no government agency is ever closed and no so-called "entitlement" is ever eliminated. :frown2:
 

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Cali may continue to do their own thing, but Trump states the process of rolling back EPA vehicle emissions regulations are beginning, going to be interesting to watch.
That would be a great thing....if it was done right. For instance, at least the way it used to be, large trucks and earthmoving equipment etc. were allowed to belch all the black crap they wanted. Motorcycles, which may in some case emit more pollution per mile, actually are a small percentage of overall pollution. And the "studies" I was able to find quickly didn't seem particularly legit. So, if the Enviro-Nazi's in Californicatia were to back of on motorcycles, which have limited space for all the eco-crap cars carry around, it'd be a good thing.

Further, these "studies" probably include off-roads only bikes, and yes, 2-strokes pollute....but so do leaf blowers, and those are probably worse. I know when I first start the car up on a cold morning (until the cat gets going), the fumes are pretty noxious, I never noticed that with the BMW, it seems pretty damn clean. The Enviro-Nazi's just hate motorcycles in general, but apparently are ok with old, clapped out lesbianmobiles (Subaru's) that blow blue oil smoke, just because they have "Free tibet!" and "Save the Whales!" stickers on them, and have a $10,000 mountain bike on the back which shows that the owner is eco-friendly. Or something like that....
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Cali may continue to do their own thing, but Trump states the process of rolling back EPA vehicle emissions regulations are beginning, going to be interesting to watch.
It'll be interesting to watch indeed. But it may not just be a case of California doing it's own thing. As I understand it, with the recently enacted Euro 4 and upcoming Euro 5 emissions standards, the European Union is far ahead of California and the U.S. Federal government when it comes to ratcheting down motorcycle exhaust emission limits. Who knows, California may be looking to adopt those standards. But even if they did, it seems motorcycle manufactures have already packed some of their bikes with the emissions controls necessary to meet those standards. Consider the first generation BMW S1000RR, as far back as the 2011 model year the bike was certified at 0.16 g/km NOx & HC.......the standard is 0.8 g/km. Take a look:

https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/onroad/cert/hmc/2011/bmw_m0060163_999_0d3_hn.pdf


What I'm far more concerned about is whether or not CARB's current efforts will give rise to a motorcycle smog check program, because everyone knows that there's a considerable amount of emissions system tampering that goes on with street bikes.
 

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I am certain that electric motorcycle is in my future, and I don't have 50 years ahead of me. And it will be because I want one.
I certainly don't have 50 years left, and I'm perfectly ok with my ICE vehicles.

You can already get electric motorcycles now. Why wait to have limited range, excessive weight, more cost, and less performance? Dooo eeeet!
 

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I’d ride one on track, probably not on the street - low noticeability.

The limiting factor for electric drive are battery size, weight, and recharge time. Once energy density and recharge time are taken care of, there’s really not much reason not to have electric drive in a consistently warm climate, if that’s still a limitation of said batteries. Look at how many advancements there are in the field: https://www.pocket-lint.com/gadgets/news/130380-future-batteries-coming-soon-charge-in-seconds-last-months-and-power-over-the-air
 

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i'm a cheap sob who just wants to go fast, when i can go faster for longer for cheaper with electric i'll be the first to ride one

i imagine a future where you only need earplugs for the wind noise on track, and if you yell real loud you can trash talk people as you pass them >:)
 

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i'm a cheap sob who just wants to go fast, when i can go faster for longer for cheaper with electric i'll be the first to ride one

i imagine a future where you only need earplugs for the wind noise on track, and if you yell real loud you can trash talk people as you pass them >:)
Can't you already psych out your competitors enough in AFM? Any limitations on livery?
A "your MOM is fast" sticker on the undertail section seems like a great way to make friends.
 

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I’d ride one on track, probably not on the street - low noticeability.

The limiting factor for electric drive are battery size, weight, and recharge time. Once energy density and recharge time are taken care of, there’s really not much reason not to have electric drive in a consistently warm climate, if that’s still a limitation of said batteries. Look at how many advancements there are in the field: https://www.pocket-lint.com/gadgets/news/130380-future-batteries-coming-soon-charge-in-seconds-last-months-and-power-over-the-air
No offense but I totally cringe when I see fluff articles like that taken as fact.

Major battery advancements, like virtually all other technological innovations and breakthroughs since man began fighting his fellow man (even before MY time), come from military research. Researchers can claim this and that as the "future", but I'll believe it when I see actual data and test results, not fluff pieces about theoretical this and that. When the military starts using things, then it's proven tech. Simply put, so far, and for the foreseeable future, it's about the major problems of energy density and recharge time. I can't see anything drastic enough of an improvement coming any time soon to the point where ICE's will suddenly become obsolete. For instance, look at the IOM TT Zero race bikes, speeds, and amount of laps vs the Senior TT or superbike race. Even with all the money dumped into them, the bikes are nowhere close to the same performance, and are heavy pigs.

No thanks, I'll keep my ICE vehicles.
 

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No offense but I totally cringe when I see fluff articles like that taken as fact.

Major battery advancements, like virtually all other technological innovations and breakthroughs since man began fighting his fellow man (even before MY time), come from military research. Researchers can claim this and that as the "future", but I'll believe it when I see actual data and test results, not fluff pieces about theoretical this and that. When the military starts using things, then it's proven tech. Simply put, so far, and for the foreseeable future, it's about the major problems of energy density and recharge time. I can't see anything drastic enough of an improvement coming any time soon to the point where ICE's will suddenly become obsolete. For instance, look at the IOM TT Zero race bikes, speeds, and amount of laps vs the Senior TT or superbike race. Even with all the money dumped into them, the bikes are nowhere close to the same performance, and are heavy pigs.

No thanks, I'll keep my ICE vehicles.
Well, the military is proof that a technology works, but I would not necessarily expect it to be a harbinger of all things to come in the future. Where I live there is an ever-increasing number of Teslas on the road being driven in practice day to day. The military probably has more stringent standards and more acceptance criteria for a technology to be able to flawlessly and relentlessly work in all sorts of climates. Hence no electric tanks, APCs, etc.

Granted, the piece I posted is a mass media aggregate at least, and clickbait at most, but there are other places that a bit more information is available. This isn't a whitepaper by any means, but at least there's a microscopic photo showing cycle-induced wear for a gold nanowire battery. https://www.popsci.com/researchers-accidentally-make-batteries-last-400-times-longer#page-2.

Now, whether it will make it's way to the market or get choked by bureaucracy, politics, and the economics of the ever-increasing Annual Recurring Revenue model is another question. After all, in the age of planned obsolescence, this isn't a common sight: https://www.upi.com/Archives/1981/05/15/1956-Caddy-approaching-1-million-mile-mark/5380358747200/
 

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Well, the military is proof that a technology works, but I would not necessarily expect it to be a harbinger of all things to come in the future. Where I live there is an ever-increasing number of Teslas on the road being driven in practice day to day. The military probably has more stringent standards and more acceptance criteria for a technology to be able to flawlessly and relentlessly work in all sorts of climates. Hence no electric tanks, APCs, etc.

Granted, the piece I posted is a mass media aggregate at least, and clickbait at most, but there are other places that a bit more information is available. This isn't a whitepaper by any means, but at least there's a microscopic photo showing cycle-induced wear for a gold nanowire battery. https://www.popsci.com/researchers-accidentally-make-batteries-last-400-times-longer#page-2.

Now, whether it will make it's way to the market or get choked by bureaucracy, politics, and the economics of the ever-increasing Annual Recurring Revenue model is another question. After all, in the age of planned obsolescence, this isn't a common sight: https://www.upi.com/Archives/1981/05/15/1956-Caddy-approaching-1-million-mile-mark/5380358747200/
Actually, look at almost all the tech today, and it was driven by the military. Internet? Check. 4-valve high-performance piston engines (WWII)? Check. Ballistics? Check. Aerodynamics? Check. Exotic materials? Check. Infrared technology? Check. Lasers? Check. Radar technology? Check. Ultra high-speed video tech? Check. Battery research? Check. Why? Pretty much unlimited budget, and the ability to circumvent patents in the name of national security. As for reliability and testing, well, it's said that an elephant is just a mouse built to Gov't specs..... :)

We have a bunch of eco-poseurs here in Boulder (entire front range, really) driving Teslas too.....to the store and back. Got a trip to another state planned? Well, gotta take the 'Benz..... I'm not convinced battery technology, by it's very nature, will ever equal that of a conventional ICE for energy density. Now, hydrogen cars like the Toyota Mirai is something I'm a lot more interested in, as I find a 22-ish hour at your normal 110Vac charge for a Tesla a mite inconvenient. Now, if we only had a source of pure hydrogen that was a net gain reaction..... ;)
 
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California is still number 1 in my heart & she'll always be :)
I think when New California secedes we should build the Southern wall and make the coast form a country independent of the USA so we don't have to support them and they'll be free to be the socialist/communist sanctuary state they want to be..... :)
 
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