BMW S1000RR Forum banner

Considering a Track Bike...

4K views 27 replies 15 participants last post by  DemonDuck 
#1 ·
Hello,

I have a new '16 RR, which I am very happy with and I am selling my '15 Single-R. I am considering using the money from the sale to buy a track bike. I've never been on a track and that begs the question why I'd want a track bike--it could end up collecting dust. Short answer is: I don't want to track my '16 RR as I'd hate to watch that go cartwheeling down the track and I also don't want to spend time converting it back and forth between street and track. I could also buy an older bike for $10K - $12K, but for a few more grand, I can get a new '16 for just over $16K. The particular example was a '16 RR used at Nate Kern's COTA track days with ~ 200 miles.

Options I am considering:
1. Buy the new '16 RR with about 200 miles on it for ~ $16K.
2. Do nothing....start with a couple days at CSS and go from there.
3. Start slowly and buy an older bike, and learn from there.
4. Just wait...other options always emerge.

The bike is one thing....but I might not be fully sensitive to all the overhead (getting bike to track, weekend time, changing the tires, etc) that goes with track days, and I am trying to understand a reasonable approach to start.

Any comments to help provide perspective? Thx!
 
See less See more
#2 ·
Buy an already setup newer track bike from the wera forums, etc for 6-7k and use rest of the money for track days and tires. A R6 or a Gsxr 600 are the top choices. Literbikes are a later step.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
  • Like
Reactions: Armando Marini
#3 ·
Before you jump in with your own bike. Go and do CSS and use their bikes. You will know if you get the bug then you can get your own. For me, riding a 16RR on the street. How the fk would I ride some old sh1tbox at the track when I ride a brand spanka on the street. I would want to ride the same bike with all the tech on it. Otherwise I would be going backwards. Luckily I hate the track so it's not an issue.
 
#4 ·
Backwards logic. Clearly you never have been on the track.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
  • Like
Reactions: Armando Marini
#6 ·
From your 4 provided options, and leaning towards cost efficiency - #2 all day, every day, if you have never been on a roadcourse with a bike.
You might go to CSS and find the experience excellent, but at the same time, not something you would/could find yourself doing frequently enough to justify another "identical" bike in the garage.

If you end up realizing after CSS, the opposite, and want to be ultra cost conscious, buy a 2nd generation R6, they're mean little machines, and can often be found track ready for less than half of the $16k you mentioned before, and you will be faster on it for quite some time than you would be on the RR, unless you are an exception.
Really there are a myriad of things to consider, and an R6 might not keep you happy. It depends on what you want to get out of the experience.
Want to gain max skill, in shortest time, least cost? = R6
Want to improve your skillset while still enjoying the incredible power of RR? = Buy a used CSS bike, they are selling them as cheap as ~$11k with track bodywork, frame sliders, etc.
In summary,
-Price appropriate trackday gear (helmet/gloves/suit/boots/back protector)
-Factor cost of trackday events, track entry fees
-Forecast logistical costs, of getting you and your bike there + food, lodging, tires, gas for the bike, you will burn through a few tanks in a weekend.

That's just a glimpse, others will surely chime in with even more considerations.
 
#8 ·
From your 4 provided options, and leaning towards cost efficiency - #2 all day, every day, if you have never been on a roadcourse with a bike.
You might go to CSS and find the experience excellent, but at the same time, not something you would/could find yourself doing frequently enough to justify another "identical" bike in the garage.
This is it. You want to dip your toe in the water. Not strip off and jump right in.
 
#7 ·
I agree with Benny.
I sold my old school 2003 R6 dedicated track bike. My '16 S1000RR will be my new track bike. Besides being my street bike.

It should only take 30 minutes or so to tape up my lights, yank my mirrors off, and swap out my smoked Puig screen with the oem screen that I have just put my numbers on. :smile2:

Granted I have done dozens of track days over about 5 seasons.
I don't know if I could ride this bike out on the track as a n0ob. :wink2:
 
#10 ·
I've never been on a track and that begs the question why I'd want a track bike--it could end up collecting dust. Short answer is: I don't want to track my '16 RR as I'd hate to watch that go cartwheeling down the track.
There it is right there, some will disagree with me but, if you're preoccupied with avoiding crashing, you'd have more fun and less stress on a machine that is 100% track only. The model you choose will be determined by your financial ability to acquire and maintain it. So if you aren't inclined to turn your own wrenches, you'll need to give cost considerations for someone who will, for you.
Just to give you a rough idea from someone who does most of his own maintenance, and already has appropriate gear- a 2 day trackday weekend ~ $350, + gate entry fees (some orgs like P.R.E. include the gate fee, camping, electric in their published trackday fee, most do not).
There are 3 venues that I have been to, and are somewhat equidistant, so gas money to and from $100.
Full tank in the bike, plus 10 more gallons, maybe 15 if I'm not tired, and there are fewer attendees. $2.25-$2.65/gallon ~$53.00
I have been staying 2 nights at a hotel on those 2 day trackdays, $200
You will want to be on new rubber too $350-$500, in two days on an RR, if you've run through 15 gallons of gas at the track, regardless of how slow you are, you could have roasted a rear tire, maybe the front too. So at the end of the weekend, you'll need to replace most likely the rear tire $200-$350. The "slower"/newer you are it is possible to wear your tires out faster than if you have some experience attending trackdays, and rolling on the power smoothly, tc or no tc. Everybody thinks they're at least a "good rider", until they participate in their first trackday. Reality sets in right after their first lap, that they are not required to follow an instructor/coach. Yes, that was and still is me, every time I attend.
$1000+ weekend is easy to reach in short order, if you account for all of your related expenses.

Sure, you can save some money without cutting corners to safety, my point is, this sh,t can quickly get cost prohibitive, and starting with a bike like an R6 or even an SV650, less power, less cost to maintain, your throttle mastery phase won't eat into your tire budget as quick as with an RR, and if it cartwheels, SOOO WHAT! You'd would really have to be hauling some major azz to break a track only bike to the point it could not properly repaired, or frame replaced, with a used non tweaked version. If you do break it, there's a good chance pieceS of you are fractured too, so the bike doesn't matter much at that point.
If you have the financial means to support having an $11500 CSS bike, as opposed to a $2000-$3500 sv650 or $6500-$7500 R6
This is my perspective / experience which may not resemble others, it is not meant to dissuade you from your quest.
This is it. You want to dip your toe in the water. Not strip off and jump right in.
Good summarization @bennymx
 
#11 ·
Taste

Everyone has great and valid points.
One thing I'd like to add, look up your local track and check their events calendar for race days, many race tracks offer ( taste of racing ). what it is, is a twenty-thirty minute ride around the track. During race day there is some down time and during that time they will allow people with correct gear and a maintained bike to explore the track for a small cost.
You won't get a full on track day experience, but you will find if this is something you'd want to do.
 
#12 ·
Everyone has great and valid points.
One thing I'd like to add, look up your local track and check their events calendar for race days, many race tracks offer ( taste of racing ). what it is, is a twenty-thirty minute ride around the track. During race day there is some down time and during that time they will allow people with correct gear and a maintained bike to explore the track for a small cost.
You won't get a full on track day experience, but you will find if this is something you'd want to do.
This. At least in the PNW that's what a few track orgs do. $20 for 20 minutes. Don't need to make your bike track ready like mirrors off or taping up lights. Does have to pass like a street level tech inspection but that's easy for your bike. Done while racers have lunch. Got me hooked for track days.

By example, I only started after my bike was a couple of years old, then said what the hell. You don't need slicks, in the beginning you should just be seeing how a wide open "road" feels to you and go from there. It's not a race. CSS is great, and I've gone as a student and as a corner worker (with free riding at their lunch and with them as long as I didn't interrupt their classes) but that's an expensive way to start from scratch. You should do it.

You can probably find somebody in your area to share a ride there and back, show you the ropes, and meet other guys that like the track. I use my S1K for both track and street. I don't have race skins, I don't safety wire anything, but have good track gear - which might also be your street gear.

It only takes a short amount of time to remove mirrors, tape lights, and check tires and brakes to go to the track. I bought my own trailer and tent and other gear only when I finely decided I would go more frequently, and have had a tire changer because of 4 bikes in the garage that get ridden a lot. YMMV.
 
#13 ·
You definitely want to get a feel for it first before investing in a dedicated bike. The likelihood of your bike "cartwheeling" is greater when you are new versus when you actually get up to speed. Most guys are surprised at how much faster a track day is from their "fast" street riding. Your brain just isn't set up to deal with it normally.

Whatever you choose, build speed slowly. ALWAYS remember your technique.

The most common thing I hear from new track riders when the go off track is "I went in too hot..." In actuality, they went in too hot for their brain, not too hot for the bike. In other words, they simply scared themselves and bailed on the attempt. Hence, a beater bike is a great idea or, simply, start in the slow group and make your way up from there over time.

Think of it like going to the gym. If you've never gone to the gym, poor technique and heavy weights will just get you hurt. Go light of the weights and focus on your technique first, then start adding weight slowly over the subsequent days. At the track, start in the slowest group and work you way up.
 
#15 ·
Low and slow is a good choice for both starting your spending and your riding at the track. Part of the reason that CSS uses these bikes is that they are so track ready and rider protective out of the box.

I run Q3's (very cost effective) and ride to the track with everything that I need in a back pack. I can be tech ready in literally 10 minutes.

My best advice - Spend any savings on training! It is your greatest protection against crashing.

Lastly, consider your conditioning. This may not apply to you at all. Some folks who go out and spend a bunch of money on a track ready liter bike have not considered how much work it is to deal with the physics of that bike at speed.

There are a lot of forces that you will be opposing that will take a lot out of you. I have seen guys with a big investment in their bike who ride a session or two into the afternoon before smartly recognizing that their tiredness makes it a good idea to take the rest of the day off. Once you have been at it a while you will be better able to gauge whether you can get the most out of your investment by staying the whole day.
 
#17 ·
Groms aren't exactly cheap. I'd go XR fiddy already setup with the big boy parts and possibly 88cc kit.
I bought one (88cc) for $750 all setup with supermoto tires, disc brakes, tall seat and bars.
I race indoors all winter in an indoor kart track. Damn good fun. Great off season training.
 

Attachments

#18 ·
I suggest just keeping your RR for now. Do 2 day camp CSS and other schools. Work on your technique.

Invest in best gear you can get. Having a better helmet, gloves, etc... made a huge difference for my riding.

I ride both on the street and track. I did over 24 track days this season and 3 mountain trips (Dragon, ridge, etc...). It takes me less than 20min to prep my bike for the track once you get the hang of it. Just drill small holes in your oil filler plastic cap and drain plug for safety wire. Or buy pre drilled ones for under $48 for both.

I removed my mirrors all together, I just have a handle bar mirror, search my threads on this mod. Works perfect for the street. No need to do anything for it on the track beside putting some tape. Costs $15 :grin2: No need to remove it as it's not in the way.

Get Pitbull restraining system to haul your bike. You're all set for the track!

I have all mods I need (for now) without having to spend the $$ on an extra bike. Instead I spend my $$ on training, tires, good brake pads, and gear. Also, keep in mind riding a different bike on the street and the track will make your riding not as consistent. If you do buy a track bike, be sure it's a RR as well. It will also keep your maintenance cheaper because you only have to be familiar with one bike.

Finally, Sprint filter, IAT relocate mod, racing seat (search for my threads, makes a big difference on the track).
Slipon will be enough if you don't plan on pushing it much, I started this way. As I got faster I just got Akra TI headers. If you have the funds just start with full TI system and call it a day.
 
  • Like
Reactions: quantized
#19 ·
You have many options and everyone will have a different opinion on whats the best way. I know several organizations that will allow you to rent leathers and such. If you have one around you that does that then take your bike and do the lowest level track day and see if you like it. Use the rental equipment so your not out money if you don't like it. In level 1 as long as you do as your told and such you will be just fine and shouldn't have any worries about your bike because your just not pushing it at that level. Your learning lines and body position and such things. If you like it then continue to the next step.

I would suggest going with a used SV650 that you can pick up for 3k or so already set up for the track. Then put a bit more money into the suspension to have it set for you .... which might mean another 1k or so if you have to replace internals.... or $50 to have it set proper.... just depends. Then spend the money on a good set of leathers and your good to go. The reason I say the SV650 is this. Its a great bike that can take corners very well when set up right. It has no balls at all which many find to be a problem because they think track days are about lap times. I went through this myself when looking for a track bike. Many people said I wouldn't be happy at all with a gutless 650 when I ride my BMW daily. Here is the deal though. I have a blast on my 650 and you will most likely become a better rider faster on a bike like the 650. The reasoning behind what I say is that you don't have HP to make up for your mistakes in a corner or early braking or being late on the throttle out of the corner and such. With the 650 if you don't perfect the little stuff you will be slow and there is no way out of it so your forced to pay attention to all the basics. You take the 1k on the other hand and mess up everything about the corner then go balls out on the straight like its a drag strip and have a false happiness thinking you went fast. Its the guys we all run into at the track that slow you down on every corner so you pass them and then the straight comes and they fly by you again just to slow you on the next corner..... all they have is the HP of the bike and the tragedy is that it actually makes them learn at a much slower pace.

Plus once you get decent you get to have even more fun pissing those guys that think they are amazing on a 600 or 1k by passing them on your little 650...... and if its a series of corners you sometimes get enough of a lead that they cant catch ya in the straight (all depends on the track). It puts a smile on my face for sure.
 
#20 ·
One thing that needs to be mentioned is that the RR is actually a great starting track bike because of the grunt and electronics.

The torque will allow you to avoid shifting as much as needed with a 600 and older bikes won't have the electronics to keep you out of trouble. Just take your time building speed.

Another great analogy is to consider playing an instrument. The first time you pick up a guitar for instance, you will be terrible. With time and practice you get better. Still, there is a huge gap between being able to play a song and being an accomplished musician.

It's the same with riding on track. Things happen quickly and you need to build up the ability to be smooth and having the movements become natural.
 
#21 · (Edited)
Thx! These are good, considerate responses. I received a spectrum of replies, all based on each person's insight and experience, which is exactly what I wanted. For now, I am doing nothing, but I will sign up for CSS shortly.

I also have to say, in all likelihood, my first step would be to sign up for CSS, and that is surely true. The one thing that MAY change this a little is there is a new track opening 15 miles from where I live in TX.

http://www.s1000rrforum.com/forum/central/196450-new-track-coming-mckinney-tx.html

Item was posted in this forum today. That MAY make the track more accessible and I'd be considerably more inclined to use the $ from Single-R and purchase a RR for a dedicated track bike. I fully appreciate that comments that riding ability comes with time and experience. Thx for all the insightful comments!
 
#23 ·
Get an SV650 and enjoy worry free riding.

Heres what the SV650 has going for it: It's cheap, reliable, plenty of power for a beginner, and you can upgrade the suspension on it if you want. You can pick them up for $2500 in great condition, especially since you live in a large metropolitan area. The stock form is plenty for a beginner on the track.

Once you ride a few track days, you'll then figure out:
1) Is track riding for me?
2) Is this bike enough for me or do I want something else?

If that's not enough, if you wreck it, you're not out hardly as much money as you otherwise would be with any other bike, and they are comparatively easy to work on. Its a v-twin so you can pretty much stick to 4th gear while riding a lot of the track and never be too far out of the power. There's just so many reasons to get one if you're just starting.

Now the undeniable logic:
1) If you track it, and wreck, you're out the least possible money
2) if you track it, and don't wreck, when you go to sell it to move up or quit, you're once again out the least possible money and you may even break even on purchase/sale price

No matter what you decide later, you're positioned for success!

Now if that is still not enough, if you have friends or relatives who have been begging you to let you ride your motorcycle, or are visiting from out of town, it makes the perfect loaner bike so you can enjoy that with them without fear of them hurting your moto-baby.

It's also a blast to ride. I'd recommend an '03 or newer, naked or with fairings isn't a huge deal, but my preference is towards the naked ones for ease of maintenance.

The world needs more SV650 riders. It's time for you to drink the koolaid, and find out first hand why these bikes have a cult following.
 
#24 ·
Your points are all valid and correct. My friend is a CMRA racer and instructor and he races with an SV650. However, I have already drank the BMW S1000RR coolaid. Hard to to think of another option. But I acknowledge the good sense in all your comments! Keep up the good commentary!
 
#27 ·
Its very difficult to back track when you have already ridden the s1k on street and track for what it offers in my opinion. Like others have mentioned, it is a great learning bike out of the box. And the electronics can be a great aid. You also get the feel of riding your own bike and understanding the characteristics.
I did my first track day with an s1k, then bought a used Daytona 675 which my brother and me shared and did quite a few sessions with that. Later in the year found a track prepped 2010 s1k. Now you wouldn't be able to get me off of the bmw.

A few months ago purchased a 16 s1k that's been converted to track after a few hundred miles. This bike is made for it.
Have never attended css. did about 2 years of track riding and run mid upper advanced group. Practice makes perfect, just go as often as your schedule allows.
The coaches are always there to help at the organizations.
 
#28 ·
I have done a few track days on my S1k and it is fun to take it out now and then. Maybe I have a different mentality than some but for me track days are for me to improve as much as I can. Yes I have fun but when im on the track at a track day its as much work as fun to me.... I am steady trying to perfect something. This is where my 650 comes in. I have no desire to get faster on the straight due to a more powerful bike and the 650 is great at showing your every mistake. If you don't get on the throttle fast enough out of a corner then you KNOW... if you mess up your line by a little then you KNOW..... You simply don't have the ability to twist the throttle and make up for the mistakes. Maybe I would think different if I didn't want to be better for the next actual race (not to mention its so much cheaper to race the 650 than a 1k). So if I went to the track for no other reason than a fun weekend and I didn't care about how fast I improved then I guess I may have never gotten the 650. And I have no doubt that I would have gotten to where I am now eventually but I also have no doubt that it would have taken me a whole lot longer and most likely more time fixing my bike and my body.

I was playing at a track day with one of my buddies. He was on a CBR600 and I was on my 650. We had coms and he kept taunting me when he would pull off on me in the straight but then I would simply get back around him on the corner. One of the times he passed me on the straight and we started talking trash.... as I passed him in the next corner I told him that its ok if he is faster in the straight because this isn't a drag strip and Ill keep passing him in the corners. After the session he started talking trash again and talked about how he could put down faster lap times making him the better rider.... so I told him that I would hop on the S1k next session and we could do it again if he would like. It was all in fun but he got the point.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top