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RR to R - Experience?

29K views 80 replies 25 participants last post by  Torchsport 
#1 ·
Has anyone here owned the RR that they rode on the street and track and later transitioned to the R? If so, what are your thoughts about your decision? I'm not asking about the differences in the two bikes. I can read the articles and spec sheets for that. I'm more interested in how happy you are with your decision? Are you having as much fun at track days on the R? Are you riding it more because it's more comfortable to ride farther/longer? Or do you miss the ergos and "hit" of the RR?

My '13 S1000RR fits me like it was custom made for me. I love the ergos but since most of my riding is on the street including trips out into some great twisties, I'm wondering if an R would feel like an overall improvement (more mid-range, more comfortable when I'm not riding at 9/10ths, etc).

I just got back from a trip to the area around Deals Gap on my RR. A buddy with a 1290 Super Duke went with me and I have to say that avalanche of low and mid-range coming from his torquey twin looked like a whole lot of fun. I may go out shopping in the high performance V-twin aisle of the scooter store for my next sport bike.
 
#3 ·
I rode an RR on the street for a couple of years, and then made it a dedicated track bike. My wife and I both have Rs for the street, we find them much more suitable for that activity than the RR. But the R would come up short on the track in my opinion, so it would depend more on your primary task for the bike. We are just this week doing all the roads around Helen Georgia and the S1000R works just fine.
If you have more questions, send me a pm.
 
#4 ·
I've ridden both enough to comment. For me I prefer the RR. The ergonomics of the R are better for long distance cruising. But I ride no hands on Cruise Control when i need a break so its really a mute point. There is no difference in mid range torque for the 15 model RR bikes. But the top end is significantly stronger as you would imagine. Mate of mine went an R as the power was enough for him. Both are great bikes
 
#5 ·
I test drove a handful of bikes; I rode R and XR for hours.

R: Ideal for around the city. Over 80MPH it does not block much wind and it just does not feel nimble/agile. It felt bulky to me.

XR: Great for sport cruising, commuting, and would do fine around the city too. Perfect for 2up. Seating position prefers riders with a long insteam.

RR: Is what I bought and like everything about it. Most balanced bike out there for street, twisties, and track.

Whatever you do be sure to test drive bikes you like in various roads; city, highway, twisties, etc...
 
#6 ·
Hey Pitts....currently in the Smokys right now:smile2: I just rode the dragon two up for the third time Tuesday on a rented Harley Road Glide. It was a great ride and I enjoyed all 11 miles of it. No question I would have liked to had my RR or my K1600GT with me but I also appreciate HD's for what they are ridden within the limit.
Back to topic, for some reason the S1000R is not a favorite naked of mine. I like twins or triples, (Speed or Street Triple), and love the newest V4 Aprilia Tuono.
 
#7 ·
Hey Jagman, I just returned from there:



This trip is what got me thinking about my choice of weapon. For the Cherohala Skyway, the S1000RR is the perfect machine as it is for tracks that like liter bikes. For Deals Gap and more technical tighter tracks, a smaller bike or something more upright in ergos would work better for me. Well, the perfect bike for Deals Gap would be a KTM MX bike with 17" lightweight wheels and some soft rubber - but I digress. I went there with a friend on a KTM 1290 Super Duke which was also a perfect bike for all the riding that we did. Monstrous power without running 5 digit RPMs and with that upright seating position the sight lines just open up more in tight switchback bowls. Maybe it's just my creaky old body but, in a racing tuck, I can't twist myself around to see the exits soon enough when the road get's that tight.

Sucks to get old.
 
#8 · (Edited)
I did test rides today back to back on the Monster 1200 R and the BMW S1000R.





Two bikes with as many differences as similarities. After owning an S1000RR for the past couple of years, the S1000R seemed very similar. The sounds, the gearbox/quick-shifter, throttle response, controls all felt all too familiar. The demo bike was still rev limited at 9K rpm but the BMW R model is just about done at that point anyway. It seemed to handle lighter with a more flickable tip in than my RR and it pulled a bit harder in the mid-range but not enough of a difference to change how I'd ride it on the street. It's basically the same bike with up-right ergos and missing that heart-attack rush on the top end of the S1000RR. Not that that's bad - on the street anyway. My horoscope told me that 14,000 rpm romps on the street will eventually end at the gray bar hotel. The '16 R feels just like my '13 S1000RR with no shift assist pro and it still has that fugly cat can under the exhaust on it. My final thought on it is that maybe the R is the bike I should have originally bought over the RR but now after having owned the RR, the S1000R really doesn't excite me.

Jumping on the Monster R, the first thing I noticed was that it seemed like a smaller and lighter bike just sitting on it. The bars and pegs fell in very comfortable spots for me but still felt like they would work for an athletic ride. I'd cranked it before throwing my leg over it so the next thing I noticed was that the TFT display seemed not as bright as I would have preferred and it seemed to me that glare would sometimes be an issue. I didn't spend any time fussing with it and set off.

On the roll, it was very obvious to me that I was riding a high compression twin and it seemed like I could feel every combustion stroke resonate through me. When I pulled away from the first light and jumped on the throttle, I had the kind of woody that only an Italian machine can evoke. Fraaack, this thing pulls HARD from way down in the revs and had me laughing inside my hat within the first half-mile. I loved the sounds coming from this bike but without the wail I'm used to, I looked down and was surprised to see that I was more than double the limit on this winding industrial park road. The handling was much lighter than the BMW. It tipped in and went knee to knee like a 600. It was a short ride so I didn't get comfortable enough to test the brakes or push it (and I wasn't ready to own a bashed up Monster R) but I can really see why Ducati is saying that this is the most track day ready Monster they've built to date. Why in the world would they leave the quick-shifter off this bike? IMO, that's the biggest deficit with a bike this track ready.

For my kind of riding on the street, the Monster R seems like an avalanche of usable power compared to the BMW that, even on the R model, needs some coals thrown at it to stretch your arms.

Now my problem is that the Monster R is way more spendy than the other bikes on my list. Like $5K more. I haven't really started to negotiate yet but I'm getting quoted over $21K out the door. KTM and BMW are discounting and throwing in extras and the Speed Triple R is just a lot cheaper to begin with. The Ducati is molto sexy but also molto costoso.

I'm going tomorrow to ride a new 2015 Super Duke 1290 R that is deeply discounted and they are throwing in an Akrapovic exhaust for no additional money. More power, less weight, shorter wheelbase, and less money. Hmmmm.....
 
#17 ·
I'd cranked it before throwing my leg over it so the next thing I noticed was that the TFT display seemed not as bright as I would have preferred and it seemed to me that glare would sometimes be an issue. I didn't spend any time fussing with it and set off.
This is one of two major complaint about the monster 1200. Dash is impossible to see in bright light. Some say a smoked shield helps.

Other issue is addressed on the R, which is the passenger peg hitting heels of rider.
 
#11 ·
If your rr fits you so well why not upgrade to a 16? The cruise control sorts out long trips as you can just sit up and ride with no hands like macca said. Personally I rode the R it was fine but I couldn't buy one just because of how it looks. I've been meaning to take my mates 1290 for a run but if I was buying a naked it would be my first choice going off looks.
 
#15 ·
I'm only doing a couple of track days a year and one of those is usually on a California Superbike School fleet bike. So, I'm still getting some saddle time at the track on the newer S1000RR. I think the reason why I'm not rushing to replace it with a '16 RR is what I said in my Monster comparo post. On the street, I'm just not using the power above 10K on the tach. And if we're being really honest here, riding the RR between 5,000 and 9,000 rpm is fine but the power delivery in that range is really nothing special that you can't get out of any 10 year old 140 hp sport bike. The engine lives to be wailed on at the track and gives up a lot of performance on the street (mid-range) to these big bore high performance twins like the KTM and Monster. The KTM makes more torque at 4,000 rpm than the S1000RR makes at it's max. And it's just getting started there. And the Monster R isn't far behind.

Sure, the ergos aren't going to work as well at the track and there's no fairing to tuck in behind on the straights but I also think maybe these big bore torquey twins might be more fun on the shorter more technical circuits. Back to my original post in this thread - I guess I'm concluding that the R isn't enough different for me on the street than the RR so my interests have gone wandering for now. And I think everyone should own a big bore high performance twin at some point in their life. I may come back around to some future version of the S1000RR when it gets it's bright TFT color display, light wheels, LED lights, and race data logger/tuner included. Its a great time to be on sport bikes isn't it?
 
#14 ·
I really want to love this bike. It just got this amazing cool vibe and soul to it and I'm going to test one before I make my final decision. I know why they left the air cooled engine in it - to keep it simple and nostalgic and full of character. But dang, that bike with the new 125 HP WC boxer would be something. I'm told Nate Kern paired his race nineT up with a new WC boxer tranny and final drive to get the quick shift pro on it. He's going to be out at Bob's BMW later this month and I'm signed up to the event. I've love to ask him about his experiences with the nineT on the track.
 
#23 ·
Wes:

Did you already sell the RR? And how did you kill it?

'12 BMW K1600GT (gone but not forgotten)
'13 BMW S1000RR (for the track, also gone - I killed it)
'14 Kawasaki KLR650 (for the TAT)
'16 R1200GS (for the epic adventure


I'm the wrong guy to try and answer your questions in regard to what bike.

I have been fortunate to have more than one bike at a time and have always tried to purchase a bike for a specific type of riding.

Every time in the past when I tried to use a bike for several purposes I was never happy.

Heck when I decided to sell my 2012 RR I had made up my mind I was not getting another one. I really did not like riding it on the street at all - loved the bike just was not the bike for me on the street.

Then I made the decision to buy my 2015 RR and also decided to only track the bike - for me - it was a game changer - love - love taking it to the track. This month I will end up doing 8 track days so I have stuck to the plan.

My general purpose bike is a K1300S - this bike is a great sport tourer - can also thrill the heck out of you in the twisties.

I've always been an in line 4 rider so I think I would tend to go for the S1000R - not to mention I like BMW's.

Good luck on the new bike selection.
 
#26 ·
Wes:

Did you already sell the RR? And how did you kill it?

'12 BMW K1600GT (gone but not forgotten)
'13 BMW S1000RR (for the track, also gone - I killed it)
'14 Kawasaki KLR650 (for the TAT)
'16 R1200GS (for the epic adventure
I posted a few details of the mishap on the iBMW forum. I'll probably post up a report here shortly hoping that someone else can avoid the mistake(s) I made. The short version is that after the 2nd or 3rd time it flipped, it belonged to Allstate. The estimate was over $15K.

We're very much alike in that I choose bikes that afford me a different experience. There's just too many ways to have fun on two wheels and not enough garage space to own bikes that have a lot of overlap in mission. If I get happy with the GS as a fat enduro bike, then I'm sure to let the KLR go and get something better for single tracks - a real enduro bike. The GS fits the mission of adventure and long road trip bike for me. So, with the demise of the S1000RR, what I'm missing is the hooligan tool and occasional track day bike. Eventually, perhaps sooner than later, I think I'll do what you've done and own a dedicated track bike as well. Each bike for it's purpose.
 
#25 ·
No doubt about that. The S1000R is the best deal in the entire BMW store. Riding that Monster R was like the first time I drove a modern Ferrari. These things are as much art as machine engaging most of your senses in a way that says that it has a soul. My BMW S1000RR (and the K1600GT, and the GS) have just as much character but it is a sense of surgical precision and function over form, performance over character. That's a thing of beauty to me too, but just different in a way that's as different as the German and Italian cultures themselves. It's actually pretty cool how these two cultures express themselves in motorcycles.
 
#29 ·
The Multistrada is an amazing bike for sport touring. I've only ridden one for a few miles and I got to sit on the new Enduro model this week at the dealer but I have no problem believing that it's a better road bike than the GS. My goal for the GS was to use it as a swiss army knife. I'm going to ride it 2,000 miles to New Mexico on the road and then ride the Continental Divide to Canada. I'm going to treat it like an enduro bike that has some road cred with the right tires on it. I just can't get my head around taking a Multistrada into challenging terrain where drops are likely. Just me - I guess some people do it?

My new GS equipped for off-road use:

 
#32 ·
I had not had the same model of bike ever since I started riding at 15. The RR is the first bike that I broke that pattern for. But my next one will probably be the KTM Super Duke GT.
 
#34 ·
Disclaimer: I've been to Scotch tasting tonight so this might not be a totally coherent "R" report.

OK, it's not Italian or German or English. Today's "R" demo was the Austrian beast, a Super Duke 1290 R with 1 mile on it.



That's my GS in the background with the new 2015 SDR in the foreground. They have a great deal right now were the bike is deeply discounted and they're throwing in the Akra silencer. I'm going to talk about the bike but first I have to say that B&E Motorsports in Easton Maryland is exactly the kind of motorcycle dealer I grew up knowing. Bob, the owner, answers the phones, sells bikes, works behind the parts counter, works on bikes, and oh, he campaigns an RC8 race bike and a RC390 race bike. It's not the big premium experience I'm used to at Bob's BMW where I feel like part of the family. It's a small shop owned and operated by a different Bob that I could see being a great track day buddy. And if I need my bike worked on, Bob will come and get it and haul it over to his dealership and bring it back for me. As much as I enjoy the experience at BMW Bob's, I'm hoping this could be the start of a fun relationship if I buy this bike (and other KTMs on my radar for playing in the dirt).

Back to the bike - did I mention that it comes with the Akra thrown in? The one that has a single set screw to remove the db killer. Bwaaahaha.



This thing just screams "I'm a hooligan!" It looks like it's doing burn outs just sitting there. The first thing I noticed about it is that owing to the V-twin bolted in there, it's about as wide as a bicycle when you look at it from the back. Sitting on it, it feels like the short wheelbase that it is and I can't help thinking that I'm sitting on a 180 HP Grom.



Like the Monster R, when it's running you can feel every high combustion stroke but when I pulled away on it, I had to negotiate through a crowded gas station and then follow a little old lady a few blocks to some clear road. That was enough to know that the fueling off idle and loping around was flawless and this bike can easily be ridden slow like a starter bike - and it felt a little like one too it's so light and small feeling. The gearing is tall but because of the massive low end it doesn't feel like it except that you can ride it like a scooter with little shifting. Bob encouraged me to ride it off in "sport" mode - the most dynamic throttle, traction, and abs map but said "New tires, better leave the TC on for a few miles before you turn it off to ride any wheelies." Like I said - my kind of dealer. The little old lady turned right and the road opened up and MOTHER Frracker! the beast got out. I came to a stop about a mile later and was just speechless. In any gear up through 4th at any rpm above about 3K it would pull like mad hovering the front tire. No wringing its neck at 12,000 rpm. Just twist and go.

There was no traffic anywhere in the back country farm roads on Maryland's Eastern Shore and Bob mentioned "See you later" when I left to I just kept going for a while. I found some twisty road, some good pavement, some not so good, and again felt like I was riding a quick handling bike about a 1000cc's smaller. I mention that the gearing seems very tall and 6th gear is virtually unusable at anything less than 85 mph. I've read that some people drop down a tooth on the countershaft and that would seem to make sense after my short ride. Eventually, when it looked like I'd looped back to near the shop, I rolled off through a couple of neighborhood streets and hit several stops just to hear it pull away from idle. No one looked at me like I was there to plunder and pillage. In fact, hardly anyone noticed me loping by. Hooligan stealth mode - check.

$16k out the door including the Akra, delivery to me 40 miles away, and my first service included if I buy the oil from him.

I came back home by the Triumph shop intending to ride the Speed Triple. I kinda expected them to be picky about the R model as they'd said they are hard to find but they had told me to come back with my gear and I'd get a hop on a normal Speed Triple. Nope. Someone must have misspoke says the sales guy there. No demo rides on Speed Triples. I guess when you have a showroom full of Bonnevilles and Indian Scouts, a Speed Triple looks like mischief to them. I explain to the guy that he's making it pretty hard to give any consideration to his product and that this week I've ridden the Monster R, S1000R, and I just rode the SDR without so much as signing a waiver or a credit card on file. Nope. Guess not.

I'm off to ride the GS off-road this weekend up in some state parks in PA and I'll decide on Monday.
 
#39 ·
Everyone's been telling me to look at the Tuono Factory. It came out on the top step of the podium at the most recent naked bike shoot out. But for some reason, I just can't like that bike. There's some cognitive dissonance with it being an Italian bike that looks like a Japanese bike. I'm a big fan of the V4 design (like old school VFRs) and the sound it makes but I just can't get excited about the Aprilias.
 
#45 ·
I called Allstate today to get them to quote adding the Super Duke to my policy that now includes coverage for my 2016 R1200GS and my 2014.5 New Edition KLR 650. My annual premium for just those two bikes $399. Adding the 2015 Super Duke with all the same coverages will make my new annual premium $429 - yep, it's going to cost me a whopping $30 annually to insure the Super Duke. This is again one of those rare moments when I get to say "It sucks to be young."

This decision is getting close to being made. I would have loved to own the Monster R and I'm positive I'd have really enjoyed owning an S1000R but this deal on the KTM looks too good to pass up. Everyone who loves riding sport bikes owes it to themselves to own a high performance, torquey, V-twin sport bike. There's something incredibly fun about how easy the power is to use on these smaller, lighter bikes.
 
#46 ·
Straying a LONG way off topic here, but I have ridden the XDiavel for a couple of hours, and the forward peg placement makes for a horrible riding experience. The suspension is stiff with a very short travel, so that combination makes my back start to hurt after 10 minutes. The earlier version Diavel is much better, although not a bike I would consider owning. The Multistrada however, is a different story.
 
#51 ·
I feel like I got so much support and advice here that I owe you guys an update on where I'm at with this search for my high performance naked bike.

A couple of weekends ago, I went off up into Central PA near State College for a couple of overnights and trail riding on my 1200GS with some new friends. Just before I left, I put a deposit on the Super Duke to hold it for me until I got back. Long story short is that I got pitched off in a full-afterburner throttle high-side when returning to the trail and hit a hidden stump in some brush. Very stupid of me to not take it slow not knowing exactly what was there but I ended up hitting the ground, oh, about 15' from where the bike stopped and slid a ways from there. The bike is perfectly fine with just a few scuffs and scratches on the protection parts. Apparently the bike is tougher than me. I cracked my shin on the bars pretty hard and got the wind knocked out of me with some considerable discomfort in my back ribs. I went back to the cabin and sat around whimpering for the rest of the day and rode 180 miles home the next day - that ride started in freezing rain.

After laying around the house in a narcotic pain med induced stupor for a week, I decided to go see my doc who sent me straight away for x-rays. 3 broken ribs, hairline crack in my tibia (all healing nicely) and a small pneumothorax (partially collapsed lung) that also looks like it might heal on its own. My doc told me that in hind sight its a good thing I didn't go to the ER with this because those docs would have stabbed me in the chest with a big bore needle to try to fix the pneumothorax that seems to be healing all on it's own. They did tell me that if I started to have trouble breathing to call 911 for a transport and the big bore needles or I might die. Sheesh, the stuff these guys will tell you to run up your Obamacare bill.

Getting better day by day and the best part is that the guy who owns the KTM dealer is holding the bike for another couple of weeks for me until I feel well enough to bring it home. I'm pretty happy with that decision and have that bike to look forward to when I can get back in the saddle. What sucks is that I'll be missing this coming Sunday's track day at Summit Point with Nate Kern. I'm planning to be at Bob's on Saturday for his presentation and meet and greet. Hope to see some of you mooks from Maryland there.
 
#55 ·
What sucks is that I'll be missing this coming Sunday's track day at Summit Point with Nate Kern. I'm planning to be at Bob's on Saturday for his presentation and meet and greet. Hope to see some of you mooks from Maryland there.
Glad you're not hurt any worse.

On another note.........only Maryland mooks?

Perimeter mooks, stay out of Maryland?

Just kidding, heal up soldier!
 
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